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Gay Jehovah’s Witness Victims

Submitted by Jaymes on March 15, 2012 - 8:35 pm 83 Comments

What happens to gay Jehovah's Witnesses?Let’s spare a moment to think about the gay Jehovah’s Witness victims.

If you didn’t know this, Jehovah’s Witnesses do not condone homosexuality. Romans 12:19 is often used to instruct the flock to ‘abhor what is wicked.’ Also, they believe that men who lie with men will not inherit god’s kingdom. In Leviticus, the penalty for homosexuality is death. Leviticus 18:22 says, ““‘And you must not lie down with a male the same as you lie down with a woman. It is a detestable thing.” Verse 29 says, “In case anyone does any of all these detestable things, then the souls doing them must be cut off from among their people.”

Obviously, in the eyes of a Jehovah’s Witness, committing ‘homosexual acts’ is a sin. Jehovah’s Witnesses are told to hate what is bad.

Not only are homosexual people not allowed privileges in the congregation, it is a cause for disfellowshipping. But that doesn’t make Jehovah’s Witnesses homophobic, does it?

Um. Yes! Undoubtedly. By treating homosexual people differently from heterosexual people, they are being prejudiced and even incite hatred. After all, you can’t just ‘hate the act’ as so many Jehovah’s Witnesses like to parrot, when being homosexual is more than just anal sex, which, incidentally, is forbidden (by the Jehovah’s Witness hierarchy), even in heterosexual relations. Sexuality is part of what makes up a person, his or her character, etc.

People don’t choose what sex they are attracted to. It is how they are born. Jehovah’s Witness literature seems to acknowledge this a little bit in the Young People Ask article, Homosexuality – How Can I Avoid It? It says, in an almost backhanded insult, “It is not the purpose of this article to delve into the “nature-versus-nurture” debate. Indeed, it seems that it would be a gross oversimplification to attribute homosexuality to a single cause. Homosexuality—much like other forms of behavior—appears to be far more complex than that.”

It also says, “Regardless of the cause, the important thing to realize is that the Bible condemns homosexual acts. Thus, the person who is struggling with same-sex desires is presented with a reachable goal—he or she can choose not to act on those desires.”

So, god created some people to be homosexual, or allowed them to be born into sin without choice of their sexuality, and will then punish them for it? Also, as a heterosexual man, homosexual relations are not something that attract me, but that doesn’t make it wrong – I used to be a closed minded Jehovah’s Witness too, but since breaking free, I have seen how homosexual relations are more than just sex – they are relationships.

By denying men and women the right to fall in love with someone based on an old, immoral, book, Jehovah’s Witnesses should be ashamed of themselves.

But what of those homosexual people who are Jehovah’s Witnesses, but ‘suppress their urges’, as encouraged in the Watchtower literature? I’ve heard it said, “Yes, but they don’t act on their impulses!” Well, how do we know they don’t? They could be succumbing to their urges even as you read this post.

The fact is that many Jehovah’s Witnesses are homosexual and have to suppress what makes them, them, all due to the homophobia that is preached throughout their ranks. Some people have even been driven to suicide thanks to this abhorrent teaching from a so-called religion of ‘love’.

  • smmcroberts

    Hey Loni, I too had my enlightenment in the Bethel Library (NY), though mine was over 35 years ago. I wish we’d had the Internet back then; it would’ve all been glaringly obvious very quickly!

  • Loni Hull

    I’m glad to be here, and thanks!

    I remember too well what it was like for me to feel utterly alone as I learned (in Bethel’s own libraries) that my faith was built upon a mountain of religious memes inherited from the childhood of our species (credit to Richard Dawkins) and outright lies. 13 years later, for those who are serious about examining their faith in the light of evidence, this site is pure gold.

    No one in the midst of a spiritual crisis today need feel alone, and I imagine that visitors here have a palpable feeling of bearing witness to a battle playing out between reason/science/true brotherly affection, and the dogma/cruelty/fear-mongering of a desperate and dying religious order. “Invitation instead of indignation” is probably all we need to offer while we watch the edifice crumble.

    I’m just thrilled to live in an age in which lies are so difficult to perpetuate, and in which sincere consideration of facts stands a chance against the self-serving old guard and their “Truth”.

  • smmcroberts

    Thanks, Loni. Good points! Welcome to the site!

    “Invitation instead of indignation.” I love that, and I’ll try.

    I find that it’s difficult to repress human nature and not come out swinging when your friend is attacked in the first sentence (“Andrew is trying to mislead…”) But you’re right: we have to cut Witnesses a lot of slack given where they’re coming from.

    While there’s little realistic hope of reaching someone like Carlos–who will just dig their stubborn heels in the more criticisms they hear of their beloved ‘Tower–there may be others, more open-minded, who will benefit from the exchange.

  • Loni Hull

    Excellent debate.

    While I admire the motives and excellent moderation of this site – and came close to administering one that would have been damned near identical back in 2005 – I resisted the compulsion to do so for two reasons: first, I no longer wanted the Witnesses to own my time, even if spent as an enemy of their genocidal belief system; secondly, because I learned as a pioneer, Bethelite, and elder that you can lead a horse to water, but you can’t force it to think (deliberate misquote).

    smmcroberts, while I enjoyed every word of your responses, the only thing I’ve found likely to change a person’s mind is an invitation to new information. I can count on one finger the number of times I’ve seen a person genuinely change an opinion in the midst of heated debate. On the other hand, simply leaving a link to a well-researched article and walking away provokes curiosity and is far more likely to result in a change of mind. Not a criticism; just an observation.

    I think Carlos was here for a reason, and we should all remember that any active Witness brave enough to visit this site is looking to test the mettle of his/her faith. While indignation at Witness views is often justified, I think I’ll shoot for invitation more often.

    Be that as it may, it looks like Carlos is giving more thought to his beliefs now than he ever has during a Sunday talk, and isn’t that the best reason for the existence of this site?

  • Carlos

    With God’s help I am never going to stop being a Witness. I am certain of what I believe and As the bible says some seeds just don’t grow on the right ground.

  • smmcroberts

    Carlos, Once again you are stating as facts things you could not possibly know.

    Yes, I was a Witness. I even served at Bethel. I used to go out in service with the then chairman of the Governing Body, Bill Jackson. But then I asked some embarrassing questions of the Governing Body that they could not or would not answer, and we mutually agreed that I should leave. http://smmcroberts.net/religion/fundamentalism/watchtower/letgovbod.html

    But there’s no way for you to know that; you don’t know me personally, nor my history. For you to state “This proves you were never a Witness” is to state more than you could possibly know: a trait you probably picked up from the Watchtower; they do it all the time.

    Also, you could not possibly know “who wrote each book of the Bible.” Yes, I know that the WT claims to know this. But Genuine Bible scholars do not know, so despite what the WT makes up and hands you as “true,” they don’t know either. DO YOUR RESEARCH!

    I WAS “reading consciously” that’s how I know that the Bible writers were not always in harmony. One relates that God commanded animal sacrifices, another writes that God never wanted sacrifices. Harmony? No: contradiction. But these are the types of verses they never have you look up in the Kingdom Hall. There are hundreds of such examples–but I’ll let you read my book, where I’ve done much of the research for you.

    I’m not gay or bisexual, so I don’t “want to have sex with guys.” I’m just saying that for those who are, it’s okay. They don’t need to worry about the ancient Hebrew’s tribal god getting upset at them for it.

    I am trying to convey that same message to you, but sadly your Watchtower indoctrination is preventing it from sinking in because you’ve gone into the Witness knee-jerk defense of the WT. I sincerely hope that someday you break free from their shackles around your mind and your life.

  • smmcroberts

    Carlos, How nice that the GB decided that masturbation is “not the UNFORGIVABLE sin!” — But who made them God? Oh, the Jehovah’s Witnesses, that’s right.

    How sad to be a slave to an organization that tells you what to do and how to live your life, and that you can’t be yourself because they think their God doesn’t like it. It’s more than sad: it can be fatal, as when they forbade vaccinations and organ transplants as being “against God’s law.” Just as they do now with blood, platelets, and bisexuality. They’ve always been wrong in the past. So, don’t you think it’s likely–given their track record–that they’re wrong now?

    People who commit rape are obviously ignoring their sense of empathy–just like the Israelites who ran their swords through babies and pregnant women’s bellies–or like Witnesses parents who shun their disfellowshipped children, or stand by and watch their child bleed to death before their eyes.

  • Carlos

    This really proves that you were NEVER a Witness. You pretended to be one. We do know who wrote each book of the bible, their names and the approximate time when they did it. You are not able to link what they say and see what the similarities are because you were not reading consciously. You my friend are what is called a apostate. I don’t need you to pity me. I have a purpose in life and feel happiness. I’m trying my best to make God happy and help others to do the same. As I said before, you want to have sex with guys awesome for you, I’m not missing anything. If we were supposed to have sex with other men then women wouldn’t have existed and men would be able to give birth.

  • smmcroberts

    Carlos, I’ve read the Bible too: twice from cover-to-cover, and then bits and pieces as a JW for years (same as you.) I also wrote a verse-by-verse commentary on the Bible (link already provided.) So, yes, I do know what it says.

    What is your evidence that the men who wrote it were “inspired by God?” We don’t even know WHO wrote it, much less their state of mind.

    You asked: “How can you explain that they lived in different times and what they wrote is the same and the prophecies are been fulfill these days?”

    Your question contains fallacies: what they wrote is NOT the same, and their prophecies are NOT being fulfilled
    in these days. The WT has changed its mind about when and how these prophecies have been fulfilled numerous times.

    Before you presume to call anyone else “ignorant,” please do a little research outside the confines of the Watchtower. You’ll soon realize what a ridiculous statement you have made here. (But even after you educate yourself, don’t have the effrontery to call someone “ignorant”–because
    it’s just rude and also shows that you make statements as facts when you don’t know what you’re talking about.)

    No, we don’t need the Bible or its God or anyone who has “more power in society” to tell us what is right and wrong. Our inherent sense of empathy does that.

    I’m not “telling God that He is Wrong” I’m telling you that the Bible is not the word of any god. If there is a god, then attributing the inspiration of the Bible to that being would be the biggest insult I could think of.

    I know that slavery is wrong. I know that killing babies is wrong, etc. If you present me with a book which you claim is inspired by a god of love, and in that book it relates that this god condoned (and regulated) slavery, and ordered his followers to kill babies, then I’m not going to believe your claim that the book is inspired by a god of love. No sensible person could.

    If you tell me that this book forbids you from being you, then all I can do (besides pity you) is to point out to you that there is no reason to believe that the book’s prohibitions should have any bearing on your life. Why? Because the book is a load of crap–as I’ve proven in painstaking detail in my verse-by-verse commentary on the Bible: http://smmcroberts.net/religion/fundamentalism/bible/cbgw/index.html

    I can do no more for you than that, except to wish you well in your struggle.

  • Carlos

    This is what the book, Young people ask says,

    As already noted, those who have fallen into the habit of masturbation are often plagued with guilt. Without a doubt, being “saddened in a godly way” can give you the incentive to overcome the habit. (2 Corinthians 7:11) But excessive guilt can be counterproductive. It can make you feel so discouraged that you just want to give up the fight.—Proverbs 24:10.

    So strive to put the matter in perspective. Masturbation is a form of uncleanness. It can make you a ‘slave to various desires and pleasures,’ and it fosters unhealthy attitudes. (Titus 3:3) At the same time, masturbation is not a form of gross sexual immorality, such as fornication. (Jude 7) If you have a problem with masturbation, you need not concludethat you have committed the unforgivable sin. The key is to resist the urge and never to give up your fight!

    If you want to get right information, go to http://www.jw.org This is the Jehovah’s Witnesses site and you will find the right information there. You said before that we are the ones that say what’s right or wrong, therefore those people that have sex with animals think they are doing the right things, are they wrong? Would you say is bad? What if you have a child and some random person rape him or rape her, is he doing a bad thing? He might think is right to do it, doesn’t him have the right to say it’s right? I’m confused now.

  • Carlos

    I have read the bible, it is something we Jehovah’s Witnesses do daily. Those men that wrote the bible were inspired by God. How can you explain that they lived in different times and what they wrote is the same and the prophecies are been fulfill these days? You are very Ignorant. If you haven’t read the whole bible there is no way you can understand it and know if what it says it’s right or not.

    You said: “We never needed the Bible to tell us what is right and wrong.” Then who is supposed to tell us what’s right or wrong? Isn’t it God? Or would you say that someone that has more power than you in society can decide what’s wrong or not for you?

    You say that the bible is not the word of God just because it doesn’t go with what you think is right. It’s like you are telling God that He is Wrong and YOU are right. That’s what you are saying.

  • smmcroberts

    Carlos, I always “think before I write,” but thanks for the reminder; it’s something that we all need to keep in mind!

    I agree with you that it’s wrong to think of masturbation as a sin. However, there’s a wealth of WT articles about masturbation being a sin. Did you ever read the book “True Peace and Security–From What Source?” I had to study that in my time as a Witness. It had an entire chapter on the sinfulness of masturbation. So did the latter book “Your Youth: Getting the Best Out of It” (chapter 5: “Masturbation and Homosexuality”)

    Personally, I was threatened twice due to this practice [masturbation: not studying]: Once before I was baptized (with the elder telling me they wouldn’t let me be baptized if I didn’t cease the practice); and later–after I was baptized–I was nearly disfellowshipped for it (but I apparently changed my ways.)

    Since when did the GB change masturbation into NOT being a sin all of a sudden? (And what gives them the right to decide what is and isn’t a sin, anyway?) Or do they still say it’s a sin, but you were ignorant of this “truth”? Or are you disagreeing with what the GB calls a sexual sin? I hope it’s the latter, because then you might as well disagree with them on bi-sexuality as well, and get on with being true to yourself.

    The other facts I mentioned in the quote you claim is “so wrong” are there waiting for you in black-and-white in the WT publications. [On the oral sex prohibition between husband and wife please see The Watchtower 12/1/1972 p.734-736.] Are you brave enough to do some research and free yourself from their arbitrary ever-changing rules? For a start, please see: http://www.jehovahswitnessblog.com/bible/bible-and-watchtower-view-of-sex/

    As I said, it doesn’t matter a whit to the point I was making whether “things were changed when Jesus came.” You must’ve missed that in my reply–either that or you forgot to follow your excellent advice to “think before you write.”

    No, I don’t think having sex with animals is right, nor with children. I think most sensible people would understand that I was referring to consensual acts between adults of the same species (regardless of gender.)

    Carlos, it’s time to get real and come [back] into the real world; your life is calling to you.

  • smmcroberts

    Carlos, you don’t follow “God’s word” either. You only think you do. Jehovah does not “say” anything–never has. Some ignorant men wrote down what they liked and then in order that people would pay attention they claimed that their god said it. There is no reason to believe them, especially when their writings were mixed with all sorts of factual errors, primitive superstitions, self-contradictions, and impossible events.

    You can believe in God without believing that the Bible is God’s “word;” millions do exactly that.

    We never needed the Bible to tell us what is right and wrong. In fact, it’s obvious that the Bible was in error about what was right and wrong in numerous instances, such as slavery, genocide, animal sacrifice, the suppression of women, and homophobia.

    You do NOT “sadly…have to live with” suppressing your bi-sexuality. It is a rule with no solid basis whatsoever. Re-examine the reasons why you believe in the Bible (outside of WT publications), because it cannot possibly be “the word of God”: http://smmcroberts.net/religion/fundamentalism/bible/cbgw/index.html

  • Carlos

    If you don’t think the bible is God’s word is fine. The bible clearly says that many would not follow God’s word.

  • Carlos

    The way that Jehovah talks to people is through the bible. So please, think before you write.

    ” It’s also irrelevant what some old men in New York (aka the Governing Body) write about it today — especially when these are the same guys who say masturbation is a sin, oral sex between husband and wife is a sin, and that a woman who is raped is guilty of fornication if she didn’t scream. ” This is so wrong. Once again get the information right before you comment. Masturbation is not a sin. Things that you are saying were done in the past and when Jesus came to earth many things were changed. We do not offer animal sacrifices anymore. Would you say that a person that loves to have sex with animals and says that loves let’s say a dog and has sex with it, it’s doing the right thing?

  • smmcroberts

    Carlos,

    I LOVE what you said here:

    “Before you comment or say anything about God or Jehovah’s Witnesses,
    make sure you have the correct information and don’t do it because you
    are resentful or because you might think that the way you see things is
    correct.”

    So, please tell me when Jehovah spoke to you and told you that loving someone was a sin [if they happen to be of the same gender.]

    What? Jehovah didn’t speak to you?! Then how are you sure that “you have the correct information”? Could it be that you’re just saying this “because you might think that the way you see things is correct”?

    You also state: ” I do believe that what Jehovah God tells us in the Bible is the right thing to do.” So, then you believe it’s right to stone sassy children and adulterous wives, and to kill “witches”? You believe it’s right to kill an animal in recompense for your sinning? You believe that genocide is right when someone tells you that “God commanded it”? You think that murdering babies is the “right thing to do”? These are all things the Bible claims God commanded, and were the “right thing to do” [and it doesn't matter a whit to my point if you think that your "unchanging God" has since changed his mind about those things; at one point, according to your Bible, God said they were right.]

    If you really believe all of the above, then it puts your beliefs about homosexuality in proper perspective for us.

    Here’s the real truth for those who can handle it: There is nothing wrong with loving a person of the same gender, or physically acting on that love. It is irrelevant what some anonymous, barbaric writers might have written about it thousands of years ago. It’s also irrelevant what some old men in New York (aka the Governing Body) write about it today — especially when these are the same guys who say masturbation is a sin, oral sex between husband and wife is a sin, and that a woman who is raped is guilty of fornication if she didn’t scream. (On the last two “sins” they have waffled back and forth: proving that they really have no clue about sexuality or what really constitutes a “sin.”)

    We are capable of distinguishing right from wrong ourselves: What is wrong is the suppression of love in any of the many forms it may take.

    Take back your life and be true to who you really are. Don’t let a bunch of deluded old fools lay a guilt trip on you.

  • Carlos

    I think that Andrew it’s just trying to mislead those that have homosexual desires and are Jehovah’s witnesses. Everybody has the right to make a decision. I’m a 23 years old Jehovah’s Witness and I am bisexual. I have never had sexual contact with a man or woman and I do believe that what Jehovah God tells us in the Bible is the right thing to do. If you are struggling with the same issue just think that there are many people that have the desire to kill, to have sex with animals, to rob, or do drugs and that doesn’t mean that it is right to do it. We feel this way because it is part of sin and the bad decisions that Adam and Eve took. Don’t allow comments like this misguide you and think that having sex with a man is the solution. It’s extremely hard to fight this but not impossible. Jehovah will give you the strength to do what’s right. I do understand what some ex-Jehovah’s witnesses are saying about dis fellowship, it is a hard discipline. You have to understand that the reason why you may be dis fellowship is to protect the congregation and because you did not wanted to change your behavior. You are not dis fellowship if you repent yourself.

    Andrew, what you said and I quote “Obviously, in the eyes of a Jehovah’s Witness, committing ‘homosexual acts’ is a sin. Jehovah’s Witnesses are told to hate what is bad.” is wrong. It is not in our eyes, JEHOVAH is the one that forbid homosexual ACTS, not the desire. We do hate what’s bad (the act) not the person. Before you comment or say anything about God or Jehovah’s Witnesses, make sure you have the correct information and don’t do it because you are resentful or because you might think that the way you see things is correct.

  • David

    Exactly! I struggled for years, but in the end I didn’t choose this. Why am I being punished for something that wasn’t my choice to begin with! They “love” but what they mean is “love, if you follow these rules, act this way, and don’t challenge one word we say”

  • Edward Fields

    We call it “the truth”. i will never step foot in the kingdom hall again. I would rather live in my truth as a homosexual man and be true to myself. Then to live a double life to please others and what they expect of me, and live a lie. I didn’t wake up one day and say ” i guess i will try being gay today”. I didn’t choose to be homosexual..

  • Andres Torres

    Neither of you were “good enough”? Please don’t think that way about yourself.

  • Andres Torres

    This happens often. People leave JWs because they want freedom to live as they please, but while they are out they never convince themselves that what they were taught was wrong. So, they go on feeling guilty about leaving until they’ve had enough and go crawling back.
    Truth is your friend has done this to herself by failing to think critically about what she was taught. The JWs will treat her fine and accept her as one of their own, as long as she suppresses her sexuality. If she gives in to it she’ll be shown the door again and undoubtedly will contact you for support.

  • smmcroberts

    Brian,

    I’m somewhat confused by your comment. You said [evidently referring to Andrew's blog] that it’s “all wrong” — but neglected to show anything wrong.

    First: Andrew never said “God hates gays.” So why do you bring this up as if it’s one of the things “wrong” with his blog?

    You said “Do not preach hate.” Where in this blog did Andrew “preach hate?” He is not preaching hate; he is clearly advocating acceptance.

    You said “your text are used wrong” and admonished Andrew to “use the bible correctly.” Andrew merely quoted the Bible and showed how the Watchtower applies it. I have seen them apply it exactly that way. If it is “wrong” then blame the Watchtower.

    You said “no one goes to hell.” How is this relevant in a blog that never once mentioned the subject of hell?

    You said “no one is born gay because of God so don’t make a clam like it is a fact.” Um, excuse me, Brian but you just made a claim as if it were a fact in a sentence in which you warn Andrew not to do that very thing! Can you say “double-standard?”

    Andrew is an atheist and so is not blaming God for making you gay. You are just full of straw-man arguments! If you, on the other hand, DO believe in God, then I don’t see how you could say that God had nothing to do with your being gay. But don’t project your belief onto Andrew.

    You said: “you are an arrogant person just because your life isn’t going your way don’t find any sort of false leak to make a religion wrong. Especially ours.” So, you know Andrew personally, then? No? Then you don’t know if he’s arrogant or if his life is peachy keen at the moment or in the crapper. You’re writing what you can’t possibly know as if it’s the truth: just like the Watchtower does! You do the same thing when you claim to know what God hates and what he doesn’t.

    When their religion is held up to honest criticism, Witnesses tend to lash out with these ridiculous personal attacks which just make them look stupid. We’ve seen it time and again on JWB. That’s why the Watchtower tells you not to leave your comments on our sites: you do more harm to your religion with your attitude than we ever could. We don’t need any “false leaks” we just need to quote exactly what the Watchtower says, and then let Witnesses speak for themselves in comments such as yours. That’s enough to keep any sensible person from succumbing to your cult.

    Finally, why do you say: “especially ours?” Shouldn’t we apply the SAME truth tests to ALL religions alike? Wouldn’t it be hypocrisy to try to exclude one’s own religion from examination? Of course it would. But none of what you said surprises me: it’s typical of a Jehovah’s Witness. I was the same way before I learned how to think:http://www.jehovahswitnessblog.com/cult/critical-thinking-skills/

  • Brian

    Andrew, this is all wrong. your text are used wrong, i doubt you even read the bible once.
    First) God Doesnt hate gays. get that straight. like you said, he hates the act(homosexuality) i am a Jehovas Witness. gay aswell and im barely 16 even now i have come to understand both sides. God side, and what we would like to choose.
    I too struggle have we not all? Pain and sadness is relevant to everyone. Do not Preech hate to these people. most of whom are ex-Jw’s. If anything, you should use the bible correctly. No one goes to hell, no one, is born gay BECAUSE OF GOD So dont make a claim like it is a fact. Your an arrogant person just because life isnt going your way dont find any sort of false leak to make a Religon wrong. esspecially ours. If you would like to disscuss this u should do it by email.

  • Jill

    My son is 17 and we found out that he was gay when he was 16. He didnt tell us, we overheard him talking about it. We always wondered if he was gay but as he also has Aspergers’ Syndrome(autistic spectrum disorder-ASD) we thought his feminine behaviour was attributable to that.
    My husband and I are both baptised JWs. We have 4 children and have raised them as JWs. Our older 2 (son 25 and daughter 23) are married and both pioneer and son is ministerial servant. Our younger 2 (14 and 17) both have ASD and my youngest and eldest have type 1 diabetes. Neither of my younger boys are baptised JWs nor do they attend the meetings. I became a JW aged 20 and I’m now 50, married to a JW for 25 years.
    When j*** said he was gay I stopped going to the meetings because I couldn’t parent him whilst thinking that he was ‘wicked’. Long story short- whilst my husband still goes to meetings I do not. My eldest ( mini servant) has just given his first full public talk so I went to listen to it to support him. The families went out for a meal afterwards to celebrate. We were not invited! My pioneering daughter married a JW who has declared that he hates my younger sons. He is a fool and doesn’t understand that we have to parent them differently as they have special ASD needs. I have persuaded my husband to allow my sons bf to stay overnight in our home ( in seperate beds) but he’s not comfortable with it. Initially our son and his bf had to stay in hotels overnight as his bf lives 100 miles away and doesnt drive. It was costing them £100 to see each other each weekend. Our 2 older children treat us like we are marked as bad associates. It stinks! Their behaviour towards us has done more damage than the news that j*** is gay. I won’t go bk to being a JW whilst my son needs my support and he will probably need that all of his life. The whole disfellowshipping thing is cruel and I am totally opposed to it Jehovah wants us to serve him willingly not because we are afraid of being df’d. I have lost my faith and have invested 30 years into something that was a blessing but has now become a curse. I have lost my friends, my family and all I’m guilty of is supporting my autistic gay son. I’m not df’d but I may as well be. It is very sad

  • Bryan

    I really like the comments of all of you… I’m from CR and I think if you are JW as me is so difficult to handle if you are gay

  • http://www.JehovahsWitnessBlog.com Steve

    Alex, you stated: “Socrates, who had penetrated many boys, was punished for ‘corrupting the minds of male youth’.”
    I would like to know the source of your information on this. I’ve read everything written about Socrates and have never heard him accused of having “penetrated many boys.” In fact, in one dialogue he is criticized for failing to engage in homosexuality.
    The charge of having “corrupted the youth” was based on his teaching them to use their minds and take a skeptical approach to the existence of the gods. It had nothing to do with pederasty (which would not have been seen as corrupting in ancient Greek culture.)

  • cOURT

    BTW…im not here to denounce jehovahs kingdom…thats not my aim. I believe in GOD i just believe that no one has the right understanding of how we are supposed to be living and the requirements. I think the world JW included have it wrong cuz it just doesnt make sense.

  • cOURT

    thats true! I live with my dis fellowshiped auntand we live directly across the street from my grandparent who are active JW’s, My grandmother is a pioneer and my grandad is a ministerial servant. My aunt was a recovering alcoholic and was baptized but fell back into her addiction after her husband (who was not a JW) passed away..and I am her gay nephew. My grandparents do not accept homosexuality but I can still go over and check on them and have meals with them etc…whereas my aunt cannot. I think we feel a bond tho because neither one of us were good enough for the organization.

  • cOURT

    I felt like seperating myself from the organization that I was doing them a favor. A very low feeling…I had a very hard time growing up this way. Happiness in my youth was all but nonexistent. I didnt know what else to do.

  • cOURT

    Matt, one of the things that really ate at me growing up in the congregation was the fact that my reputation as a gay person would indeed change the way I was allowed to serve within the congregation. Now,I say reputation and let me be clear that I never CAME OUT…even to this day I have never officially did that and I didn’t have any form of any relationship until I was 19 and pretty much not going to the meetings on a regular basis but I live in a very small rural southern town (Alabama). Word gets around fast. I was always trying to hide the fact that I was gay..ALWAYS. I took extreme measures to try and ensure no one would learn my terrible secret but it never really worked for me (just really made me feel like a fool, as if every one could tell and i felt like I mustve looked ridiculous lying) So,,,I was still teased at school,called names like fag and queer although I was a virgin in all aspects. I didnt have any friends. I didnt want anyone to know who I was. I didnt want any attention. And here I am supposed to be spreading the good news to my peers but because (despite my exhausting efforts to hide it) they knew I was gay I felt really uncomfortable witnessing to them. I was always taught not to do anything that would bring reproach on God or the organization and I felt like by me giving witness to anyone it would send the message that JW’s allow gays to be ministers. How do you get bullied, teased and tormented at school and then show up at their doors with your family? I heard a brother give a talk once and say that someone with such a rep shouldn’t be representing the org. as it would cause others to stumble or make outsiders feel as tho it was ok and it wasnt.

  • cOURT

    WHERE ARE THESE CONGREGATIONS THAT ARE SO FULL OF LOVE AND ACCEPTANCE. THAT ACKNOWLEDGE THAT THEY HAVE GAYS IN THEIR CONGREGATIONS?? SURELY NOT HERE IN ALABAMA. SURELY NOT.

  • http://www.lgbtwolverhampton.org.uk Martha

    Andrew, thank you for such a wonderful site which I hope will help many gay Jehovahs Witnesses. I think is is so very sad, this harsh struggle they must go through. I wish you could send this to every gay Jehovahs Witness as you explain things so brilliantly. I do not understand the religion but have realised how awful it is for gay people having been bought up as a JW. It seems incredible that religion can say it is all about peace and love and then persecutes people for something they cannot choose. I wish you could reach out to all those poor people praying and living a lie, trying not to be gay to stay a JW.

  • Peagreen

    Ps sorry about all the typos – typed on my iPad without my glasses!